Rock County’s Finest warden…..Boyd Richter….

Harry Langer had a fall turkey tag and went out hunting, he’s about 74 years old. A flock came and they spotted him as he was pulling up the gun so he quick took a shot. Instead of 1 turkey he got three. He felt really bad and did’nt want the others to go to waste so he called Boyd Richter when he got home and told him what happened. He ended up with NO turkeys and a $280.00 fine.
Moral of the story,,, if you make a mistake HIDE IT!!!!
Richter you are the reason SOME hunters dont; trust the d.n.r!!!!!!!!

So much for honesty being the smartest move huh?

That’s rediculas if you ask me. Buttttt, some would try and take advantage of known situations like this if they ever got busted in the court room. The laws have loop holes and that seems the way out more often than common sense.
Give the man his turkey back.

I know that we need the wardens. I also know that I would not give one the time of day for fear that I might get a ticket for having an illegal watch on my wrist. I have heard way too many stories like this. I have also had way too many bad experiences with wardens, in none of which was I doing anything wrong, to ever trust a warden. If you do something wrong by accident, hide it. If you see something wrong ignore it.

Be careful about a blanket statement concerning ignoring law infractions. Things such as the way over limit bust(s) were accomplished only because concerned sportsmen reported it in the first place. The DNR (generally way under staffed) needs all of our help (and eyes) to do their jobs in a manner that benfits us all. The case in question, I agree, could have been handled differently. I know like any law enforcement, there are cases that are exceptions to the rule. This sounds like an honest accident that fits the exception. I know the DNR position is that careful shot selection could have prevented the over harvest but when the guy honestly reported his mistake, no doubt there should have been room to cut him a bit of slack.

How Sad,
74 years old and he tried to do the right thing, That Warden is the type that gives the other Wardens a bad name.
Mavzer if you send me a pm I’ll put into a collection for the old coot.
Bowfinhunter

I’m in for $25 to cover this ticket. If we send this money out to you Mavzer, can you see that it makes it to him?

And please, to those that will use this example to go on and on about the bad, evil DNR… most intelligent folk realize why this DNR officer did what he did. Did he have a choice as a career DNR officer? Well, maybe. His choice was this…. overlook a game violation and run the risk of setting a precendent with others that would have heard of this story plus risking his job had his supervisors got wind of his descision…. or he could have given the ticket. As he did. He is not judge and jury. His job is to enforce game and fish regs and let the courts sort out the details. This is probably one of the best cases I’ve heard of where the details just need to be told to a judge who has the POWER to say, “hey, gotcha. Understood. You goofed and followed up in a very responsible manner. Case dismissed.”

I feel sorry for the old guy that was just trying to be honest and find a solution that he could feel good about. I applaud that. That’s why I want to help cover the cost of his ticket. But I also feel he and others need to recognize their personal level of resposibility each and every time they pull the trigger.

A friend of mine had a similiar situation years ago. He accidently shot two turkeys in one shot. After notifying the game warden and showing him the circumstances he didn’t get a ticket but was told he might have to pay restitution for the extra turkey. I don’t know if he ever had to pay for the turkey though. I wonder if Harry might have brought the turkeys home before contacting the warden hence the fine. Nevertheless, it’s dissapointing that he would get a fine after contacting a warden.

That’s what I was in a round about way trying to say.
James- You have such a way with words. I agree 100% the warden would be the one taking the risk. This is one for the Judge to decide. The warden just did his job, and I am sure this is one he would’nt tell his friends about.

I think he DID recognize his responsibility and that is why he called the warden in the first place. I don’t agree with the statement that he screwed up. From what I’ve read so far everything he did was quite legal and ethical except for the fact that 3 birds fell instead of one. And that has to be considered a fluke. 1 in a million. Taking all 3 birds from him was wrong. Fining him was wrong. He had a tag for one bird and that is what he should have been given. And NO fine. The warden should have thanked him for his honesty and effort to do right. The biggest problem I see in this is a total lack of common sense on the warden’s part.

I think he DID recognize his responsibility and that is why he called the warden in the first place. I don’t agree with the statement that he screwed up. From what I’ve read so far everything he did was quite legal and ethical except for the fact that 3 birds fell instead of one. And that has to be considered a fluke. 1 in a million. Taking all 3 birds from him was wrong. Fining him was wrong. He had a tag for one bird and that is what he should have been given. And NO fine. The warden should have thanked him for his honesty and effort to do right. The biggest problem I see in this is a total lack of common sense on the warden’s part. I just hope you have some judges up that way who do have some of that common sense that seems lacking in other areas.

Sorry for double post. Did I mention common sense? Hhmmm, where did I leave mine today anyway?

We all see your point(s) Herb. Me included. For the most part, I agree. I’m just saying, I can understand the position of the warden. I simply cannot believe he feels good about issuing this particular citation. Someone calls him and says I accidentally killed 2 birds over my limit. On one hand it would be easy to look at this obviously honest citizen and say “hey, stuff happens. No worries. We’ll forget about it and thanks for letting me know . Says alot about you as a hunter, a sportsman… and as a person and I’ll find a deserving home for those two other birds.”

That would be reality in a perfect world. We’d all catch one 10 Lb walleye a week, the ducks would always be flying and turkeys would only fall one at a time.

Reality is this game warden is a public figure. He is a law enforcement official working with guys that aren’t always “honest and guilt of 1 in a million flukes.” His job is not to “dispense common sense.” It is to inforce game and fish violations. And he has critics. Critics that would accuse him of not only enforcing the law by issuing citations but also acting as a judge and jury in the field making snap descision on WHICH violations deserve to be enforced. Now THAT is a very sticky business that has only one eventual outcome in this highly litigious society of ours. His butt is going to get dragged in front of his supervisor or worse yet, a disciplinary hearing committee. That is the reailty of our society and as much as we don’t want it to be that way, it is.

First of all-I like to shoot rifles and handguns but I havent hunted before. So please rip on me if this is an ignorant comment…

Is it possible that the reason the warden issued the ticket was for being careless with a firearm? If the guy saw the turkeys and rushed the shot, is this a normal thing to do or should he have measured up and taken an accurate shot even if the wait likely results in loosing a bird? He couldnt ticket the guy for taking a careless shot since he wasnt there, but he could ticket him for over the limit.

Does this warden have a reputation as being especially strict?

Just curious.

Hi DaveB,

You are on the right track. I hear hunters calling in elk that were mistaken for moose during the proper hunting season. (Ontario) The hunters get fined and are suspended from hunting the rest of the season and possibly the next years season also.

Now I know that calling in and being honest is the moral thing to do but the Wardens fine them anyways. Main reason being is first to be sure of your shot and animal identification.

The above is why a lot of game up here goes to waste. Accidents happen but people realize that if they report themselves they will lose the priviledge of hunting.

I’m not sure what I would do if it happened to me……….

Roger Mayer.

Speaking of being careless with a firearm…..See this story just posted on WCCO.

http://www.channel4000.com/sh/news/stories/nat-news-aptv-178363820021113-111116.html

J.

Stuff like this is so touchy. Do you enforce qualifications for the elderly to operate firearms and motorvehicles? In the original post, I agree with the judge factor. Maybe you’re not supposed to shoot into a flock? I don’t know but moving game and shotguns isn’t always as accurate as we’d like it to be, no matter how talented the shooter.

In Jon’s latest submission, the guy was able to confirm that he fired the shot and new it to be a mistake! For cryin’ out loud……………..that just doesn’t sound right! A deer disguised as a horse with a rider??? Oh yeah, that’s an old trick from the frontier days! Granted, those boys that started hunting that long ago were never forced to pass a hunter’s safety course but it just chaps my hide that there are people who will fire without absolute verification of the game and the shot! 200 yards? That’s a long shot for a shotgun but someone needs to give this guy some binoculars before he kills someone!

Everyone, if you hunt, don’t risk it! Be certain beyond certainty before pulling that trigger!

did you here about the guy that shot his rich father in law deer hunting last weekend?

He claimed that he saw an orange deer making coffee outside of his tent.

Bad joke stolen from Louie Anderson via KQRS-sorry.

All I gotta say is a slug at 200 yards? At 89 and he hit the horse at 200 yards with a slug and he thought the horse was a deer? If he could hit it at 200 yards with a 12g slug I would assume that he could identify the animal with a rider on it!!!!!!!!!!

Roger Mayer.

This guy was lucky he was in Wisconsin… Down here he would have gotten $1000 per bird, loss of privs, potentially loss of vehicle if it was used to transport them.

After all: Some people “don’t buy into the concept of ‘little slip-ups’ and have nothing to fear from the DNR.” Sound familiar? I guess those people think that this old codger has no excuse and is very clever to try to cover his tracks using the whole “honesty” ploy.

Completely freakish that people who were ready to crucify the Red Wing over-limit violators prior to their conviction or public release of the facts are calling for this guy to get his day in court. Do DNR tickets even get a day in court? I don’t really know the answer, just asking. I know that the DNR is only considered an enforcement agency when it serves their purpose – the rest of the time they are a regulatory agency and I’m not sure that the appeals system (assuming one exists) is through the courts. Maybe we could get some answers from a warden.

Even so, selective enforcement is not only possible, it is absolutely crucial to the separation of powers doctrine. The old dead guys who founded this country knew darned well what they were doing.

Love the comment about the illegal watch, as well as all the ‘hide your mistakes’ rhetoric. Where did all the cheerleaders go?

I was lucky enough to draw a turkey permit in Minnesota’s 2002 Spring turkey season. I attended the DNR sponsored Wild Turkey Clinic at the Cottage Grove Armory on 6 March 2002. I learned a lot at the clinic and it applies to this post. The Minnesota DNR Hunter Education Program Wild Turkey Handbook specifically addresses this issue on page 30. I quote ” Question: What do I do if I shoot at one turkey and accidentally kill two or more? Answer: We realize that on rare occasions an unseen bird or a “flyer” BB might result in more than one turkey being killed by a single shot. However, all hunters should know that their target and backdrop are clear for the shot, and hunters should be patient enough to wait for a clear shot at a single bird. Please do not seek out the tag of another to “cover” the extra bird. This would constitute illegal party hunting and only compound the problem. Besides, you would only be denying that person of the thrill of taking his or her own bird. Instead, we ask that you leave the birds in the field and contact the local conservation officer.”
A Minnesota DNR Conservation Officer personally reiterated this policy during the clinic. He advised everyone to leave all the shot birds in the field and call a Conservation Officer. He said if we did that and he arrived we would not be charged with exceeding the limit. But if you pick up the birds and transport them that would create a violation situation.
There is more to this story than we all probably know. I for one trust our CO’s and I am proud of the job they do for us. I do my best to uphold the game laws in Minnesota and I work at setting a good example for everyone I hunt and fish with. I stay informed. If I see someone violating any game laws I’m going to take action. Thats my two cents worth.

Ya gotta ask yourself one question. If the warden would have been the shotter, or maybe co’s dont hunt and fish, would he have had one of his warden buddys give him a ticket, and surrender all 3 birds, or better yet would he have gave himself the ticket? I bet he would have eaten wild turkey for thanksgiving dinner also. What-da ya wanna bet?

I admire the fact that the gentleman turned himself in. And I do believe that’s what happened… he broke the law by killing 3 birds. Certainly it was an accident but it doesn’t change the fact that he had 2 birds over his limit.

Did the CO have to report the violation? Yes, as it’s their responsibility to enforce the regulations.

Perhaps when I’m 74 I will know to face up to my mistakes, rather than try hide them and live with the consequences of being a less than honest person. The man sets a fine example to live by.

Hey Gianni….
yep… no matter what state you in.. (well at least Mn, Ia or Wi) you DO get your day in court for a ticket if you wish it.. just like a speeding ticket. if you wish to plead guilty just send in your fine.. otherwise you will be showing up in court…..

Darn, I hate to be one to keep this going but, I can’t help myself. In certain situations wardens are encouraged to use their own discretion as to whether a citation is issued. This should be one of them.
Now then, some of you say he’ll have his day in court. Hope it goes well for him. I mean that.
I’m not sure how things work in Minn. or Wisc., but here in Ia. it’s not very pretty. Many years ago when I still did some hunting I had the opportunity to sit in court while some friends went before a judge for a couple game law violations. These really were “honest mistakes”.
While standing before the judge, he asked them how they pled, guilty or no? The fellows tried to explain their case to him and he cut them off and repeated the question, guilty or no, and added they were entitled to hire an attorney if they wanted. In short, they knew the fine with costs was only 60.00 and if they hired a lawyer they might beat it, but the lawyer’s fee could break them so they pled guilty and paid the fine. That is what law enforcement is counting on to happen.
Now, does anyone know for sure whether or not this guy transported those birds?

I appreciate that this string is going on. It is good to talk about such dilemmas. It is good that noone is getting heated up over it. This discussion will cause a lot of readers to hash out their feelings toward the subject and enable them to make good well thought out decisions in the future. If I was in the old guys position, I would not have reported it. I never would have taken the shot but if I had and the situation was the same, I would not have reported it. If I had seen him I probabally would have turned him in provided I could stay anonymous. This would be a good topic for a FTR Poll. What would you do______?

I can’t honestly say how I’d react if I’d witnessed this infraction. For me it really depends on if I thought he broke the law on purpose, which I still don’t think he did. When we type out our thoughts and opinions on subjects like this, I think we-I sometimes forget that every situation is different and has it’s own set of circumstances involved. Most laws were made to cover generalities and the courts are there for each individual case, hence the use of discretion by the wardens and police officers to prevent flooding of the court system with cases like this. Not everything is black and white. Maybe that’s why humans have the power of reason.
Have a nice day all.

Don’t try and tell me that nobody has ever rushed a shot before in there life… 99.9% of the time you miss or get the one bird/rabbit/whtever you were shooting at… He accidently hit a a couple others…. I have shot at ducks and had the pattern take out one that I was not shooting at… it could have been one xtra, woody, or a extra hen…. what do ya do??? 1 let it sit there and rot. 2. Stick it in the decoy bag and take it with you. or 3. call the local warden and tell him of the incident and tell him that it was a honest mistake.
well, I think that Boyd Richter has set a standard> Whatever you do DONT do the right thing! Cause you will be fined and your game will be confiscated….
I don’t want to hear about the d.n.r warden is “Just doing his job” believe it or not folks the d.n.r have some discrepency in certain situations….. A poacher is not going to purposely shoot three turkeys and then turn himself in, claim it’s and accident just to hopefully get the turkeys back…..

Mavzer….. given the situation that you detailed, I simply HAVE to agree… you had a good sportsman who had a total accident and wanted to do the right thing… ONLY a very law abiding person and an upstanding individual would have went to all that trouble….. somehow his “reward” does NOT seem JUST… wasnt it just this spring we went to bat for someone on the DNR who was getting creamed because he killed a cat in the line of duty? that wasnt fair either……
I say lets stop talking about this.. and lets DO something…. James earlier said he would send the guy money… at the least lets do that… Im in for matching James $20…. but I think we need to mobilize our political power… find out who is the person(s) to target and lets start making a difference!! (and making their lives miserable till justice is done… lets even get the media into this.. they LOVE human interest/injustice stories.. and this one is so ripe its rotten!)… thats why you posted this Mavz… right?
ok.. so anyone have an email address, phone number or mailing address that we can send our thoughts too?

well speaking in a general way; I feel the CO’s should be supported and encouraged to do their duty as sworn officers. It makes me wonder how many “yes officer, buts” they hear in an average week? No matter the diffaculty, the courtroom is the place where your “side” is heard. That’s our system. Yes, I will call TIPS anytime I see something that I feel should be brought to the attention of an enforcment officer. Have before, will again. As a group and as a forum shouldn’t “we” also support the impartial and vigorous enforcment of the laws protecting the lands, waters, and resources ? On another question. And generally speaking of course. Does anyone have an opinion as to whether the State should take an interest in the matter of the compatance of someone going afield with a loaded fire arm. Beyond licensening do you think a person’s capability for good judgement be considered, such as advanced age and diminishing faculties? good fishing, kenn