I find this trend where more and more outdoors people seem to see the DNR as “the enemy” to be very distressing.
Similarly distressing and probably related is left vs Right and dem vs Rep.
Distrust of the govt is trending.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>TheFamousGrouse wrote:</div>
I find this trend where more and more outdoors people seem to see the DNR as “the enemy” to be very distressing.Similarly distressing and probably related is left vs Right and dem vs Rep.
Distrust of the govt is trending.
Maybe the head of the DNR should be an elected position rather than an appointment by the Governor. Give us a chance to elect the best qualified person for the job!
-J.
Give us a chance to elect the best qualified person for the job!
-J.
The last 2 presidential elections have clearly demonstrated that we are too stupid to handle such responsibility
“Maybe the head of the DNR should be an elected position rather than an appointment by the Governor. Give us a chance to elect the best qualified person for the job!”
I agree with this 100% and think that the top directors’ positions in fisheries and large animal areas should be elected as well.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Jon Jordan wrote:</div>
Give us a chance to elect the best qualified person for the job!-J.
The last 2 presidential elections have clearly demonstrated that we are too stupid to handle such responsibility
And appointing people who consider being outdoors is driving with the windows down is better?
-J.
Maybe the head of the DNR should be an elected position rather than an appointment by the Governor. Give us a chance to elect the best qualified person for the job!
-J.
So where does this end? You only just suggested that we elect the DNR commissioner and 2 posts down we have another member suggesting it should be this plus department heads…
Are we going to elect the entire DNR top to bottom? So are we also then going to elect ALL agency commissioners and staff top to bottom? Why just the DNR, why not the DOT and the DHS?
IMO this would be unworkable. We live in a REPRESENTATIVE democracy. To try to have citizens micromanage government agencies would produce a rolling series of disasters and all real expertise would be pushed out of every agency and replaced with the guy who got 4 votes instead of 3.
I don’t want every agency run by the person who produced the best campaign ads.
Grouse
Do more with less. I love this one. With the cost of nearly everything rising, I’d love to the people who propose this try to actually be in charge and implement it.
Lol, your talking to a manufacturing engineer who is paid, rather well, to accomplish just this.
To suggest there is no waste, is a suggestion that we operate in a state of perfection, which is a problem statement itself!
just to confirm we are talking about $3 here right? Ok. got it. just checking 
Grouse,
The point is make sure you know what your candidate stands for and hold them accountable when they lie.
Governor goofy lied on just about every promise he made to us outdoors voters. 
-J.
just to confirm we are talking about $3 here right? Ok. got it. just checking
ANY govt increase is suspicious. But yea, I know what you mean.
The Outdoor community in this State is a large one and we have expectations on how this state should be run concerning it. This is a totally different position than lets say the DOT commish’ and it is looked at totally differently by a very strong contingency. It should be an elected position and I have been preaching this for many years…
I find this trend where more and more outdoors people seem to see the DNR as “the enemy” to be very distressing.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>FishBlood&RiverMud wrote:</div>
The government just demands more money, and apparently spends copious amounts to ensure they’ll actually get more when they demand it. Imagine if they put the same effort in finding ways to do more with less. Lol.Do more with less. I love this one. With the cost of nearly everything rising, I’d love to the people who propose this try to actually be in charge and implement it.
Even with massive gains in efficiency, it’s almost impossible to provide the same products/services at a lower cost over any significant period of time because ALL costs rise.
I laugh at every CEO who tries to BS his way out of a bad earnings quarter or year by pitching cost cutting measures. You can’t cost cut your way to profitability, that’s just BusinessBS from someone who’s proving they don’t understand finance or economics.
Efficiency and cost containment are necessary and effective, but eventually you have to have revenue. Remember all those dot.com statups back in the 1990s? Yeah, it doesn’t do you any good to cut costs 20% if your balance sheet shows you running a $20m loss for the year.
Every year the cost of doing business rises, be that for the DNR or any other org or person. Eventually, only an increase in revenue will allow any org to survive.
Personally, I think the DNR does a tremendous job overall and I totally get that it takes money to do this. I don’t agree with everything they do, but unlike so many these days who seem to attribute this to malice on the DNR’s part, what I’ve seen is more indicative of the old truism that you can’t please all the people, all the time.
Grouse
+1
The MN DNR is being criticized for a small license increase, while leaders at the top starting with Trump’s and his cronies likely cut funding with the next budget for anything related to Natural Resources, and anglers complain that they don’t catch a limit of fish each outing. It’s a thankless job. Given the resources, political climate, and relative ignorance of SOME outdoorsmen/women…the MN DNR deserves accolades.
My favorite part of these forums are when specific posters go off about poor fishing, closed seasons, C & R, poaching, etc. but badmouth the DNR and license increase all while proudly voting for leaders who don’t give a damn about the outdoors.
It’s one big circle of stupidity 
Lol, your talking to a manufacturing engineer who is paid, rather well, to accomplish just this.
To suggest there is no waste, is a suggestion that we operate in a state of perfection, which is a problem statement itself!
Where did I say there was no waste? I’m looking at the whole picture and saying eventually revenue MUST increase for every organization because not ever cost can be cut year after year.
So as a manufacturing engineer, what are you doing to hold down the growth of wages paid to you company’s employees?
Also, what are you doing to stop the increases in healthcare costs paid by your company? Also, what do you when fuel prices spike, how do you cut the price of a global commodity?
I’m talking about the whole picture, not just one aspect like procurement.
I totally agree, efficiency is a good thing and I’m with you, I’m all in favor of more of it. I’m sure there are plenty of opportunities in the DNR.
But there are also rising costs on the other side of the ledger that cannot be controlled easily or sometimes at all for that matter. Wages go up, healthcare goes up, I don’t care how hard you negotiate, you’re not going to buy the same new pickup truck today for less than you bought that truck for 10 years ago.
Eventually, revenue has to go up. Only revenue is revenue. Cost cutting just keeps more of that revenue for the bottom line. That’s my point. We can argue if it has to be now vs later, but to me given how long ago the LAST fee increase was, a modest hike now seems reasonable to me.
Grouse
The MN DNR is being criticized for a small license increase, while leaders at the top starting with Trump’s and his cronies likely cut funding with the next budget
I think this is more a result of our society now. You can get everything right now, customized to how you want it for next to nothing relative to historical prices. However, when the populace looks at Govt and it’s agencies it is the polar opposite, slow, inefficient and non-customizable. People are also realizing more and more how much they pay for these gov’t “services”, and are demanding more for less like they get everywhere else.
given how long ago the LAST fee increase was, a modest hike now seems reasonable to me.
I agree with this, but then also see the DNR spent over $7 million on AIS last year.
It has always bothered me that 20% of the clean water, land, and legacy amendment goes to support arts, arts education, and art access.
agree with this, but then also see the DNR spent over $7 million on AIS last year.
x2
Grouse,
The point is make sure you know what your candidate stands for and hold them accountable when they lie.Governor goofy lied on just about every promise he made to us outdoors voters.
So your beef isn’t really with the DNR commissioner then, it’s with every voter in this state that elected Governor Dayton. Twice.
Even if the DNR commissioner was directly elected, they wouldn’t be above politics because the governor and the legislature still hold the checkbook, the lawmaking power, and the veto power. The other branches of government can literally still force the DNR to do anything and the commissioner would have no legal power to resist.
Specifically, what are the promises that Governor Dayton “lied” to us outdoor voters about?
By the way, I’m no Dayton supporter and I have voted against him every time he has appeared on my ballot in Minnesota.
With that said, I would give Dayton credit for some things I think he and his DNR administration have done well. Specifically, I give him credit for the fact that he promised to protect water with a buffer strip requirement in the face of withering fire from Big Ag and he and the legislature got it done. This is a huge win for anyone who cares about water quality in MN.
Also under the Dayton DNR we have had a significant expansion in the MN walk-in program for hunting access. This has been the ONLY bright spot in hunting in MN given the massive loss of land enrolled in CRP in this state.
Obviously, I have items on the other side of the ledger as well. Like the Governor’s constant caving in to the Mille Lacs resort owners. I’d give Dayton a C grade overall, but I guess I see shades rather than just simple black/white when it comes to politicians. Even the ones that I didn’t vote for.
Grouse
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>TheFamousGrouse wrote:</div>
The MN DNR is being criticized for a small license increase, while leaders at the top starting with Trump’s and his cronies likely cut funding with the next budget for anything related to Natural Resources, and anglers complain that they don’t catch a limit of fish each outing. It’s a thankless job. Given the resources, political climate, and relative ignorance of SOME outdoorsmen/women…the MN DNR deserves accolades.
My favorite part of these forums are when specific posters go off about poor fishing, closed seasons, C & R, poaching, etc. but badmouth the DNR and license increase all while voting for leaders who don’t give a damn about the outdoors.
It’s one big circle of stupidity
Exactly.
Where did I say there was no waste? I’m looking at the whole picture and saying eventually revenue MUST increase for every organization because not ever cost can be cut year after year.
I would agree except we are talking about a government agency whom I’m sure have waste beyond belief. That likely, a single incident of entirely nonsensical spending, if avoided, would add up to the amount this pidly $3 (more on other things) increase will create in revenue.
So as a manufacturing engineer, what are you doing to hold down the growth of wages paid to you company’s employees?
Also, what are you doing to stop the increases in healthcare costs paid by your company? Also, what do you when fuel prices spike, how do you cut the price of a global commodity?
You find ways to remove cost from your product or service in regard to the 7 wastes that apply to anything we do in life. All are opportunities to improve.
You can pull cost out of everything, if you consider time a cost. There is a point of reduced returns of course, with everything.
In my experience, large organizations, if YOU look in the right places, have worlds of opportunity to turn a buck, or a few million.
Sounds like some of you should be on the Citizen Oversight Committee:
http://files.dnr.state.mn.us/aboutdnr/gamefishoversight/2012-overview-game-fish-fund.pdf
http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/gamefishoversight/members.html#jeaton
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>TheFamousGrouse wrote:</div>
given how long ago the LAST fee increase was, a modest hike now seems reasonable to me.I agree with this, but then also see the DNR spent over $7 million on AIS last year.
X3!
just to confirm we are talking about $3 here right? Ok. got it. just checking
Not to call you out “Crappie” and I agree its only a piddly $3 but this trend of thinking is what gives government their bad habits of asking for more $bucks before examining efficiencies and possibly new ideas. I cannot think of a single government agency that would survive if they were forced to operate in the public sector of commerce. IMHO
We are not talking 3.00 , the fees for just about everything outdoors is in the proposed increase.
Hunting licenses
Boat stickers
Atv license
Snowmobile license
Park fees
Ect.
If it was 3.00 increase per item I wouldn’t have a dog in the fight.
Only if we could tax all those paddleboards on the lakes in MPLS.
just to confirm we are talking about $3 here right? Ok. got it. just checking
It may only be $3, but it is 12%.
Empty the AIS budget and put that money into COs.
Scrap the plans for an unending money pit of a hatchery on Mille Lacs. The lake is a walleye factory. Fix the problems with Mille Lacs, example, end co-management, and the lake fixes itself.
Then I may be on board with a 12% price hike.
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>crappie55369 wrote:</div>
just to confirm we are talking about $3 here right? Ok. got it. just checking
It may only be $3, but it is 12%.
Empty the AIS budget and put that money into COs.
Scrap the plans for an unending money pit of a hatchery on Mille Lacs. The lake is a walleye factory. Fix the problems with Mille Lacs, example, end co-management, and the lake fixes itself.Then I may be on board with a 12% price hike.
The Mille Lacs issue is enough of a reason to get rid of the current clown running that farce in St Paul. I would vote (if we could vote…) for the person that promises to fix what the current DNR has screwed up on that lake alone. You said it best: That lake is a walleye factory!
I wouldn’t mind the increase but the DNR has screwed up so bad for the fishing in this state it’s pathetic. Personally give mille lacs back to the tribe and we can buy tribe stamps like they do SD for fishing.
I wouldn’t mind the increase but the DNR has screwed up so bad for the fishing in this state it’s pathetic. Personally give mille lacs back to the tribe and we can buy tribe stamps like they do SD for fishing.
SD does that? I’ve always thought that would be a good idea but I also see a lot of guys wouldn’t do it on principle.
Mille Lacs is a political, social, economic and ecological mess. I’m glad I don’t have to lead that effort.
If the DNR wasn’t pulled in all of those directions the solution would be much easier. People act as if the DNR can do whatever they want. They can’t.
Only if we could tax all those paddleboards on the lakes in MPLS.
I’m pretty sure that paddle boards greater than 10′ (which most are I believe) do require watercraft registration.
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