The guys down in New Zealand have done a lot of research into aging venison as part of their very large commercial deer industry down there.

They have come to the conclusion, that for the best results a Fallow (I’m assuming your Whitetail will be similar) needs to be hung whole for a minium of 7 days before butchering.

Ideally the carcass should be hung just a couple of degrees above freezing and somewhere a draft can circulate around it.

This doesn’t mean immediately putting a warm carcass in a cold chiller however, as there is a risk of “cold shortening”. Ideally the carcass needs to slowly cool in two or three stages over the first 24 hours.

Leaving the carcass whole allows its own body weight to provide a stretching effect that helps to combat cold shortening.

Generally speaking, the older the animal the longer it should be hung.

I have eaten Fallow that had been hung for two weeks in a chiller and was just starting to smell a little “gamey”, and it was absolutely fantastic.

I should add this initial smell is not actually from the meat itself, but from any blood left on the interior surface of the carcass…a wipe with clean kitchen roll soaked in white vinegar will remove it, but its the sign that its time to butcher.

This is the ideal way to handle venison, but its not always practical depending on the circumstances when the beast was taken.

I should also add that the condition of the animal prior to the shot also plays a big part on how the venison will turn out. With Fallow and Red for instance, if you shot a mature buck/stag in or just after the rut, the carcass is usualy terrible. Shoot that same buck a month before the rut and it will be different eating…Doe’s /Hinds suffer less variance, but the carcasss from a doe/hind in milk will usually not be in as good a condition as a one that is not feeding a fawn…

Regards,

Peter

Is it considered bad taste to laugh at somebody elses misfortune???

I have to say thats the funniest cam camera pic I’ve seen!

Checked the carcasses in the mini-chiller tonight and decided to cut and butcher them tomorrow.

So spent a little time skinning them out this evening to allow the meat to “set” over night…

Every body has a different way of skinning out a carcass, but the gutting hook below is about the best skinning tool I’ve tried.



The hook part is great for making the initial cuts up the legs ect and by turning the blade around and using the blunt curve on the back, its great for pushing between the skin and the meat. I used to “punch” the skin off using my hand/fingers, but this is far easier, especially on a cold carcass.

LOL

Did the cam survive???

Good job it wasn’t a bear!

Jeff,

I’ve just started this myself after getting a chance to shoot out to 1000m.

As far as equipment goes, it really depends what you want to do..if you intend shooting F class or similar, you’ll need some fairly specialised/expesnive kit to be competative.

If you intend shooting just for fun, a number of heavy barrelled factory rifles will do the job. I’m biased andwould recommend a heavy barrelled Howa, but a Rem 700 or Tika would work just as well.

My Howa happens to be in .308win, and while it works, one of the fast 6.5mm or 7mm’s would be better, as would the various .338’s..

Scope wise, I went with a 4-16x50mm S&B with a Mildot reticule and mil turrets as keeping both reticule and turrets in the same units makes life much easier..

Regards,

Peter

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Great story Pete, by the way what is a muntjac?

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Darrin,

They are small primitive type of deer originally from Asia that were introduced into the UK in the late 1800’s and have since become feral.

They breed like rabbits with the does being more or less constantly pregnant from the age of six months and dropping a single fawn every 7 months.

Because they are non native and have no fixed breeding season, we can shoot them all year around. Ideally, you need to shoot either the very young or heavily pregnant to prevent orphaning fawns.

In Thetford we cull these to control numbers and reduce their impact on the local fauna…

To give you an idea of their size, the pic below is a yearling doe I shot last year..I’m guessing she is about 10 months old as although she had lost her fawn spots, all her permanent teeth had not yet errupted…

The next pics are off the net and show Muntjac bucks, although the second one is very much a trophy class animal.

Regards,

Peter

Brad,

By and large wild deer in the UK are pretty healthy. Out of the several more serious diseases we look for theonly one that crops up with any regularity is TB. Other possibilities would be foot and mouth, and anthrax, but neither have been found in British deer to my knowledge.
If the carcass shows any signs of these “notifiable” diseases, you have to notify the State Vet and get him to involved.

A couple of more common conditions of a less serious nature which crop up from time to time are liver fluke and tapeworms..

If you go to
Best Practice Guide and then click on the link “Carcass Preparation” on the left had side of the page, you will get a number of sub headings including two on Carcass Inspection and these will explain thing far more comprehensively than i can..

Regards,

Peter

John,

As you might expect it varies quite a bit depending where you are in the UK, but generally we don’t get the extremes you guys get..

For us in Thetford, Friday was pretty wet and miserable, with drizzle and a bit of mist, but temps just above freezing..Saturday was dry but cold, with temps a few degrees below, and again a patchy mist first thing in the morning…Sunday was probably the best day, it that it was a touch warmer, but still misty…

A couple of weeks back, we had about 6″ of snow on the ground, so I was glad when that went, although we are expecting more, but again nothing like you guys on the north east coast are getting at the moment..

Regards,

Peter

Addiction to drugs or booze is a terrible thing, and for many there is no shaking it once it takes a hold. But in the beginning, it is a life style choice; nobody forces an individual down that path but themselves. So while I can pity a person lost to addiction, I don’t actually feel sorry for them. In this case it sounds as if the guy is a complete waste of space.

A few weeks in solitary in jail might help him go cold turkey, but I bet he would revert to his old ways on release..

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Musk Deer are a species of deer that are very small in nature and develop “fangs”. Although whitetail are a different species of deer, it’s possible there is some residual DNA in a whitetail that could cause this.

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Ruger2506,

I’m not a 100% certain, but I’m fairly sure that picture is of a Chinese Water Deer.

As to the residual “fangs” they are more commonly known as “tusks” or “ivory” and in Europe they are prized as a trophy in their own right.

I have seen them in Red deer, and I knew they were present & quite well developed in North American Elk, but never realised Whitetails had them.

The pics below are off the Net and show what can be done with Elk and Red Deer “ivory”

Regards,

Peter

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Was there a post earlier about chinese water deer having some sort of “fangs” so to speak? Is that true pete?

By the way awesome pics please keep them coming

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Upman, both the bucks and the does have fangs, although the bucks are generally larger as might be expected.

During the summer, our club has stand at a couple of the larger “game fairs” (a bit like you gun shows?) and one of the tink we do is put various heads and skulls on display.

Its quite interesting to see the reaction of Joe Public when they see a CWD skull for the first time. The net pics below show what I mean:

Muntjac also have visible K9 teeth, although a lot smaller than CWD.

Below the skull from a representitive Muntjac buck off our Club ground. I clean the skull more for practice than because it was a particuarly good trophy. In other parts of the country, Muntjac do produce heavier/bigger antlers, but the area I stalk is not known for producing good Muntjac or Roe….

Its pretty common for the bucks to beak one or both K9 while fighting, and although small, muntjac have been known to kill dogs that try to get to grips with them…

Regards,

Peter

Thanks again to every one for the warm welcome…

With regards to seasons, below is a link to the *close* season for deer in the UK..So out side those dates, deer can be legally stalked.

Close Seasons For British Deer

Regards,

Peter

Joel,

No wild turky’s as such…There are a couple of shooting estates up in Scotland that have apparently introduced them “behind wire” but thats something I have mixed feelings about..

I suppose in times gone by, the nearest we had was Capercaillie, (see net pic below) This is the largest member of the grouse family (cocks reach up to 10lb live weight) and they were stalked and shot, usually with a .22 Hornet or similar.

I think the are still hunted the traditional way over in Scandinavia, but in the UK the are too rare to shot, although I think technically they are still classed as a game bird.

In the UK they mostly confined to the higher ground in Scotland, and from probably the 1960’s onwards went into decline as large areas of forest were deer fenced…

Today there are moves a foot to try to preserve them, but their numbers are pretty low, so its touch and go whether it will be effective.

Regards,

Peter

Again, thanks to everyone for the warm welcome.

Brad, a bit like your Whitetail, our Reds vary in size depending on which part of the country they are from, the weather, and the available food.

Generally speaking, the Reds on the open hill in Scotland are the smallest. A Stag will often dress out (gralloched, head and lower legs off, but skin on)to between 150lb to 200lb…

In other parts of the UK, they get considerably bigger. I was on the Isle of Arran stalking about 4 years ago, and somebody shot a stag that dressed out to 380lb! Although I have read of slightly larger in the UK, they do getbigger again in parts of main land Europe. At the end of the day, they are cousins of your Elk, although on average, the Elk will be a much larger animal…

I’ve never taken a 12 point stag although I’ve been close a couple of times. I have taken a a few 10 pointers and a fair few staggies over the years, like the one below,

I am sure one of these days my luck will turn and I’ll get my “Royal”!

With regards our Sika and Muntjac deer, they were introduced into the UK in the mid to late 1800’s, but its only post WW2 their populations have really taken off. Chinese Water Deer are another non-native species that was introduced at about the same time, but they have remained fairly localised.

In most of England and Wales, plus parts of Scotland, we also have Fallow in good numbers. Many think of Fallow as being one of our native deer, but they to were introduced, probably by the Normans nearly 1000 years ago…

So strictly speaking only Red and Roe are native, but all the others have established feral populations and are available to stalk completely “fair chase”..

Regards,

Peter

Brad,

Thanks for the warm welcome..Rather than hijack this thread, I’ve post an introduction and a few pics in the General Hunting Forum,

Regards,

Peter

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What I need educated on is how does one choose a 12-40 vs. 20-60? I guess it depends how far you want??

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I addition to Brad’s excellent post, two other things to consider are quality of the optics and the tripod your going to use.

Currently the Nikon ED50 Fieldscope is getting rave reviews for a mid priced spotter, with many on the birdwatching forums commenting on how excellent the optics are. This is a very compact spotter available in straight or angled format and which takes a range of Nikon eyepeices

On another hunting forum, a guy there was able to compare that scope with a fixed x30 eyepiece installed with a friends Leupold Gold Ring 12-40x60mm…They could both see .223 holes in the targets at 200m with the Nikon, while neither could with Leupold even when it was set at x40 power.

Now the Leupold is considered a fine spotting scope, and it would probably out perform the Nikon as the light started to fail. The Leupold also has far better eye relief than the Nikon, which is important if you wear specs..

But it does show that quality optics do make a difference more than perhaps the figures for basic magnification and objective diameter suggest.

The other thing to consider if you want a spotter with a max of x60 power is that you will need a very steady/rigid tripod to get the full advantage of it. Stead/rigid usually means “heavy” so the whole set up may not be particularly portable for say a hunter, but might be ideal for range use..

Regards,

Peter

Howas do shoot well, don’t they?

These are some targets from my SS Howa with the standard barrel and cheapy Houge stock. I did intend re stocking it, but I am loath to alter anything!

These were shot at 100m off a bench and the orange aiming dot is 1/2″ diameter..

My only dissappointment in the rifle is that its not very rust resistant…I know no stainless steel is truely rust proof but old Ruger All Weather is alot better in this respect..Its not a big deal, as I bought the Howa with the intention of Duracoating it anyway…

Regards,

Peter