Zipper merge

Why is it so hard for Minnesotans to understand and execute the zipper merge?

Everything is supposed to be velcro now.

they can’t even coast to slow down and need to hammer the brakes instead. easy things are very difficult here.

“Passive Aggressive”
We Minnesotan’s own this one.

I don’t think it’s Minnesotans. It’s people who live in urban areas. Ever drive through Chicago?

On 94 heading towards Alexandria a few years back, saw a semi force a car into the ditch. The car was doing the right thing, going up to the point of lane closure.

Eelpoutguy wrote:

“Passive Aggressive”
We Minnesotan’s own this one.

This is it. We think the person is just trying to be greedy and cut in front of everyone.

TH wrote:

I don’t think it’s Minnesotans. It’s people who live in urban areas. Ever drive through Chicago?

LOL the traffic is always bad there so not sure what the point is.

yea..drive in st cloud on a rainy summer day!!!!!!!!!!!

I drive for a living and merging in general is a concept few understand properly. Getting the best spot in line, in the larger spectrum of our lives, gains us nothing more than the stress of going after it. It’s a difference we never account for, recognize, or remember, yet “it’s important.”
When a lane is closed, don’t wait, get in line.
However, the minute the position idiots wreck that flow, zipper is the way to go. Therefore, if you see two lanes active, use them. But if only one lane is active and flowing, keep it a single lane.

Just yesterday, I-35 south, one lane and lots of brake lights. That means someone jacked the flow. Use both lanes. Get it started. If anyone (typically a semi) tries lane blocking, get a video if you can and document the vehicle info. It is illegal to block an active lane of traffic for any reason and for a commercial vehicle, it comes with more consequence than a simple ticket. Seriously, turn them in. You have the right and it’s the only way some people will ever learn. If they get caught up in a slowdown and fail to get into a more preferable lane ahead of time, that’s their own fault. I have no problem making them own it.

Now, once you get to the point of merge, be kind. I know those semis are a pain in the backside and you hate the view behind them, but you’re really not losing enough time to make or break the difference in anything, and more often than not, they’ll keep things moving instead of the usual speed up/slow down the four wheelers insist upon. If it’s their turn, let them in. For all the people that DO squeeze out the rigs, this is largely the reason they don’t like to play nice. They learn, via the inconsideration of others, that if they don’t “take it,” they’ll never get it. Believe me, I see this every week; it’s a two-sided coin more than some power trip. And realize, every semi driver knows what it’s like to drive a car, but most car drivers have no idea what it’s like to drive a rig, and there’s plenty of buttheads in both camps. Be kind.

Anyway, the only way to change it is to change it ourselves first. Yes, document and submit violators to authorities, but do your part like the person next you is your mother. Leave space for other mergers and it’ll improve the flow tremendously. As for those behind you when you create that space, everyone needs to learn to create more space. Following too closely causes excessive braking and the accordion effect begins, simply because everyone follows too closely and often, often, often, are not focused solely on the road ahead.

And as a bonus, I love watching the lane jumpers jump a lane as it’s plugging! Makes my day to watch people who do not understand traffic flow in the least, fight with traffic for 10 minutes, only to sit at the traffic light of an off ramp as I go rolling by. The difference between spot 1 and spot four is about 10 seconds. 10 seconds! Tell me, anyone… what happens in that extra 10 seconds that was worth all the lane jumping?

Nobody thinks any more, they just “feel,” and often make no sense at all.

Sorry but it really pisses me off when there is a lane closure and most get in the thru lane and cars zip by in the closed lane.
Then expect to get in line with the good people who wanted to keep traffic moving along by being in the thru lane early enough to not stop traffic.IF everyone would do this there would be a marginal slow down.

Zipper merging is new to many Minnesotans – I have found it works extremely well if there are a sign or two or three (especially an electronic sign that says “zipper merge ahead use both lanes“).

My observation is that it is nearly always a pickup that decides to stop the zipper merge by using holding both lanes up. On a rare occasion a semi-trailer.

Tom P. wrote:

Sorry but it really pisses me off when there is a lane closure and most get in the thru lane and cars zip by in the closed lane.
Then expect to get in line with the good people who wanted to keep traffic moving along by being in the thru lane early enough to not stop traffic.IF everyone would do this there would be a marginal slow down.

If cars zip by in the “closed lane” are they knocking down the barricades?

If people would use both lanes the backup would be 1/2 as long! The problem is the people that get over 3 miles ahead of time then get pissed at the people using the open lane! Oh, and I understand the frustration of being passed by 50 cars. Fortunately it’s a commute, not a contest.

Exactly dave and EPG. A closed lane is different from an open lane that’s closing soon. If you’re a good driver you try and even it up by using both up to that point. Only idiots would get pissed off by that.

Tom P. wrote:

Sorry but it really pisses me off when there is a lane closure and most get in the thru lane and cars zip by in the closed lane.
Then expect to get in line with the good people who wanted to keep traffic moving along by being in the thru lane early enough to not stop traffic.IF everyone would do this there would be a marginal slow down.

You mean they ride in the closed lane till the end of it like it’s supposed to be and they do it the right way??

Tom P. wrote:

Sorry but it really pisses me off when there is a lane closure and most get in the thru lane and cars zip by in the closed lane.
Then expect to get in line with the good people who wanted to keep traffic moving along by being in the thru lane early enough to not stop traffic.IF everyone would do this there would be a marginal slow down.

Would love to know your thoughts on roundabouts

Tom P. wrote:

Sorry but it really pisses me off when there is a lane closure and most get in the thru lane and cars zip by in the closed lane.
Then expect to get in line with the good people who wanted to keep traffic moving along by being in the thru lane early enough to not stop traffic.IF everyone would do this there would be a marginal slow down.

this mindset is exactly why the zipper merge can’t be executed properly by the masses. I bet Tom P is one of those guys who blocks the open lane so no one can get by and do the proper zipper merge

I think what you’re saying is you hate all 2 lane traffic and wish everything was just 1 lane

The “Minnesota Nice” Zipper Merge block.

-J.

I’m a little more leery about it in construction zones because everyone’s angry that they have to deal with it. But as far as normal merging, I get a big kick out of properly executing the zipper merge and see how many times someone gets angry at me for doing it the right way. it’s like 50×50 and I think it’s hilarious.

Another thing I notice is that people take advantage of semis when merging in traffic because semi drivers try to give themselves room to break . Most people see it as about a 6-8 car length gap in otherwise tight traffic, but that gap is there for a reason.

There sure are a lot of assumptions made by some on this board might be one of the one`s that zip past drivers in line early causing the issues.

Usually there are signs miles ahead of the actual lane closure the idiots won`t get in line early. I am better then the rest of you slows traffic as then they expect everyone to stop and let them in at the last minute. Where as if everyone would merge early traffic would not come to a crawl.

Tom P. wrote:

There sure are a lot of assumptions made by some on this board might be one of the one`s that zip past drivers in line early causing the issues.

Usually there are signs miles ahead of the actual lane closure the idiots won`t get in line early. I am better then the rest of you slows traffic as then they expect everyone to stop and let them in at the last minute. Where as if everyone would merge early traffic would not come to a crawl.

Ok, got it

Not every merge is a zipper merge. People in more urban areas would do well to remember this. If you want to merge in rural MN you choose your spot between vehicles and accelerate or decelerate to acquire that spot without disrupting the flow in that lane. If traffic is moving regularly you don’t zipper merge.

Tom P. wrote:

I am better then the rest of you

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Riverrat wrote:

you choose your spot between vehicles and accelerate or decelerate to acquire that spot without disrupting the flow in that lane.

Exactly, not the driver in the traffic lane having to the merger in. Merge vs Yield. Many drivers don’t know the difference.

I have some expertise with actual training/classroom time with traffic control operations.

The zipper merge works.

The zipper merge isn’t the cause of traffic backups.

Exceeding traffic capacity is the cause of backups.

When you have two lanes going say 70mph with an average following distance of four seconds, and try to put those same two lanes into one lane, YOU WILL HAVE SLOWDOWNS=BACKUPS.

There’s is no way to prevent slowdowns when you take real estate away on busy or semi-busy roads. The only way to fit 10 pounds of potatoes into a 5 pound sack is to make mashed potatoes. It’s as simple as that.

Trying to move over sooner only slows that lane down sooner, backs it up sooner, and backs it up longer.

When traffic volumes are low, losing a lane won’t cause backups. If there IS enough room to do it sooner, then there IS enough room to do it later. It’s just a lane change at that point and not a “merge into traffic”. Five pounds of potatoes will fit into a five pound sack without backing up. Read that twice.

When it comes to backups, traffic is like an accordion.

Picture a single file line of 100 cars at a dead stop and the light turns green.

Now, picture two lines of 50 cars at a dead stop and the light turns green to merge into a single lane.

Which scenario will clear out faster???

I tried to zipper merge on 169N in EP on Saturday evening, some guy in a truck towing a trailer got so pissed off that I waited until the road ended to merge that he pulled on the shoulder next to me and tried to run me off the road.

Good times!

Tom P. wrote:

There sure are a lot of assumptions made by some on this board might be one of the one`s that zip past drivers in line early causing the issues.

Usually there are signs miles ahead of the actual lane closure the idiots won`t get in line early. I am better then the rest of you slows traffic as then they expect everyone to stop and let them in at the last minute. Where as if everyone would merge early traffic would not come to a crawl.

We’re all part of the problem, unfortunately you’re not part of the solution.

Words of wisdom

If you merge early, you are basically saying to everyone behind you, go ahead of me… I am in no hurry and want to make this line as long as possible for me. Don’t get pissed when cars pass you, going all the way to the actual merge area.