Okay… I don’t want a new rifle, I don’t want advice on changing to another caliber. BUT… if you were going to carry a 7mm Rem Mag instead of a .30-06 on an elk hunt, what grain bullet would you use? Or would you just carry the .30-06?
30-06 with modern bullets will do anything the 7mag will do, unless you’re shooting something 400 yards away.
150 to 160 grain bullets in the 7mm Remington Magnum will get the job done on an elk hunt.
Buffalo Fishhead
Something lighter recoil – I was one of those guys that thought recoil didn’t bother me because it didn’t hurt my shoulder . But I couldn’t group my 7 rem mag worth a dam , put me on the 22-250 no problems . That Thing got in my head ! I’d go 270 .
Would not have the slightest hesitation to hunt elk with a 30/06. It may not blow through wind conditions or have projectiles with the sectional density of a hot 7mm, but it is more than adequate for elk if you can get inside 400yds.
This recent cripple normally uses a 6.5×284 or 6.5×06 (or a smoker), just because I have them and prefer the mild recoil. If I had a 30/06, I would use slipperier 180gr projectiles with controlled expansion for tough hide and bones. Accubond, Accubond Long Range or Hornady 178gr ELD-X…the latter 2 require a 1:12″ twist rate minimum. Factory ammo is available in all 3.
Elk do not die as hard as some might have you believe. Like any other animal, it’s knowing the anatomy and placing your shot absolutely on call. That is easier to do the closer to them you can get.
Something lighter recoil – I was one of those guys that thought recoil didn’t bother me because it didn’t hurt my shoulder . But I couldn’t group my 7 rem mag worth a dam , put me on the 22-250 no problems . That Thing got in my head ! I’d go 270 .
Yeah, I am a recoil wimp. When I shot 1000yd comps, lots of folks used the 30-338, the 7SAUM, the 300WM, 300WSM and the 6.5×284. Though I did use the 308 and 6.5×284 at times, the one they didn’t like to see on the line was the 6BR UBL…shot a 105gr VLD at 3040fps from a 30″ Bbl. Hardly any recoil at all in a 14-1/2# rifle.
If I remember correctly I used 175 grain nosler partition and 160 grain barnes ttsx to great affect on elk and caribou
First of all, I agree with everyone saying if you have a .30-06 that shoots well, why would you change?
Also, as a matter of future practical concern, the 7 MM Rem is in rapid decline as far as overall popularity. If you look closely at the rifles that are currently chambered in it compared to 10 years ago, you are down to a tiny handful of factory rifles even available in this cartridge. If you have a loaner available, it’s one thing, but to go out and buy a new 7mm Rem in this day and age, well, just understand you may be buying a rifle that will be considered a white elephant in just a few years’ time.
Now before all the 7mm guys heap scorn on me, let me say that IMO there’s nothing wrong with the 7. For decades it as rightly seen as a “do it all” chambering for North America and rightly so. The decline in its popularity is more to do with the supremely accurate and capable cartridges that came after it. There are just so many cartridges that use modern bullets to do everything the 7 mag could do and they do it with lower recoil and in a shorter, lighter action.
If you go forward with the 7MM Rem, I’m a big fan of letting the rifle guide you to the right decision. I would start at about 150 grains and then move upward to see what the rifle really shoots well.
There is always a sweet spot and my feeling is why fight this? With modern bullets, 10 or even 20 grains of bullet weight makes no practical difference at all in real-world hunting conditions. If you have a rifle that shoots, say, 150-grain bullets really, really well, then why would anyone force-feed it 170 grainers just because some guy on the internet said that was “better”?
I say this all the time. Modern bullet construction has changed everything. In the past–over a span of many decades–there was a tendency to compensate for poor or inconsistent bullet performances by upsizing the caliber and bullet weight. Theis culminated in the disease Magnumitus Americanas that really dominated rifle development from the 1950s and for almost 40 years hence. If big was good, then BIGGER was better. Damn the recoil man, full speed ahead.
Starting in the 2000s, the new century and new offerings in both bullets and cartridges convinced many hunters to question if they were trying to make a dead animal even deader by overkilling both cartridge and bullet weight.
We are now well into a full generation of hunters who really don’t remember a time before we enjoyed the bullet performance and consistency that we have now. In conversations that begin, “What’s a good bullet for…”, the answer today is, “How long have you got?” There are just so damn many…
After years of carrying a .30-06 stoked with 180-grain bullets, this past season I shot the biggest buck of my career with a 6.5 MM and a 120-grain bullet. Laid that buck out flat, he died with his boots on without taking a step.
In the same season, my son shot one of the biggest body-weight deer I’ve ever seen with a 90-grain bullet out of a .243 Win. This buck managed to get about 100 yards before he piled up stone dead. This was the 10th deer that rifle has shot with those 90-grain Nosler bullets and none of them has ever made it farther than 100 yards before piling up, and 6 of them folded up like a suitcase and died in their tracks.
Bullet performance and supreme accuracy even in the entry-level rifle categories have changed everything about what is really needed when it comes to a given species.
This is all part of a much longer story… and I’ll leave it be, but I am where I am by simply not paying close enough attention. The deal(s) were just too good to pass up if I was going to return to a stage above .308, which many elk hunters also use, and my grandfather used on moose… successfully. Range is always the concern when thinking about the west.
A part of me is saying, “Enough already. You’re plenty ‘gunned up.'” Another part says, “Remove all doubt and mag up.” Recoil is an issue and honestly, I just don’t want to buy another firearm.
The Tikka Roughtech 7mm met my shoulder for the first time yesterday and with the muzzle brake, it’s easy to take. So, why not use it? But the .06 is even easier on the shoulder and comes very close ballistically on grain-to-grain comparisons. I also know what the .06 likes, and it’ll drive nails @100yds.
If I upgrade, looking at 300 win mag (hard to argue against, but recoil) or possibly the new 7mm PRC.
I’d carry a 30-06 loaded with 180 Partitions. I had a 7mm Sako, and it kicked as much as it’s big brother, the 338 WM Sako I got, so I dumped it. I think that a 30-06 will do just fine.
One thing about calibers if you shoot factory ammo…
Some ammo is damned near impossible to find on the shelves. A good example is the latest gizmo caliber…6.5 Creedmore. 7mm Rem Mag, even though enthusiasm is waning, can be impossible to find at times. Not so with 30/06. It seems to be available most anytime.
My head has not gotten any better since last week!
I just watched a YouTube video from Ron Spomer, and his question was, “Is it time to put the old .06 out to pasture, or is it just getting started?”
Yep, he doctored up some of the comparisons but his biggest point, for me, was the fact that modern powders and bullet designs are now outperforming the early 300 win mag productions. As everything advances, it maintains a separation, but it does not necessarily tell the truth or address capability growth.
Given the difference in recoil, the savings of not buying another rifle, and the capability coverage, I’m thinking I won’t go any larger. .30-06 is going to the mountains. I may still bring the 7mm, as lighter grains can outperform the .06 and still kill an elk readily. I really don’t know what my coverage needs will be until choose where I’m hiking out to find a bull. I believe my bases will be covered.
Thanks again for the input guys! Much appreciated!
Remember, guys like Spomer simply write articles and/or make videos. Many times those types makes valid points, other times not so much. Yes, powders and projectiles have improved the 30/06….but they have for the 300WM too.
If you learn the wind while shooting your 30/06 (the hardest thing to master beyond 300yds), it will do everything you need it to for any North American game. An even larger point is learning the terrain that you hunt and how the animals react to changes in it so that you can predict their movements and get right on top of them.
Good luck when you go. Be sure to post pictures 
The world record Kodiak brown bear per B&C was shot with a 30-06. It’s adequate. Seal Team 6 hunters who don’t feel like hunting, but taking 800 yard pokes find it inadequate. Hell, Hemingway shot a rhino with one free handed from 200 yards on a safari, back before there was no knowledge of the 30-06’s shortcomings. Magnums are longer barreled, longer actioned, heavier, just not something I’d want to lug around. For what it is worth, a 180 grain, well constructed bullet traveling at 2750-2800fps, will kill anything with 4 legs.
Good luck when you go. Be sure to post pictures
If I get one, you can bet I’ll be sharing the results with IDO!
About writer’s like Spomer, I may not have explained myself very well when I ripped on doctoring some comparisons, but what I meant by “maintaining separations” is exactly what you pointed out with the advancement of the 300WM ballistics as well. They both improved, but that becomes the illusion of inadequacy. As we make our comparisons, the separation between the two never goes away. The information I realized was missing was the historical data. While the 300WM is still outperforming the .30-06, we aren’t aware that the modern numbers outperform the original product without a bit of research. But who thinks to compare modern ammo to ammo produced 50-60yrs ago?
If the introduction of 300WM was the cat’s meow on elk (same old animal roaming the same old ranges), then those ballistics are still adequate today.
So, I concluded that if “new” .30-06 equals “old” 300wm, it doesn’t matter what the “new” 300wm is doing, unless I choose to contract a case of magnumitus, that is. I have no need for the “new” cat’s meow to achieve my objective. And with less recoil? Sign me up!
I cant offer you any help in choosing the best rifle for you but I will provide a neat side note.
Years ago I had a 7mm mag and a 243, both Remington BDL rifles, I was looking at both boxes of Remington factory rounds and reading the ballistics printed on the box.
At 500 yards, the 7mm had the exact same ballistics as the 243 did at the muzzle.
That makes for two very flat shooters!!
150 to 160 grain bullets in the 7mm Remington Magnum will get the job done on an elk hunt.
Buffalo Fishhead
10000% agree. Spin a Barnes 150gr through that tube at about 3280fps and you’ll be very pleased. Brother n law and all his kids have 7mm mags and they perform well. Recoil is minimal if you keep with a laminate or wood stock. Plastic stocks lighten it up but then it kicks a little. Regardless of apps and all the trajectory info, that 7 will out perform an ‘06. We’ve tested the hell out of them and wouldn’t change. Only other options I would consider would be
Moving up in size and pressure and won’t meet your original post. BUT long live the 270wsm!
BUT long live the 270wsm!
Long story Randy, but the short version was this: Remington Core-Lokt 150gr 270wsm… was not the round I wanted to shoot. So, I tried better rounds and that Tikka T3 Hunter would not dial! Core Lokt 150gr… all day long, but it wouldn’t shoot anything else. Upgraded to a Browning BAR Shortrac in 300wsm. Would not dial. So, I dumped my #1 and #2 elk options after I lost my hunt to wildfires and before the makeup date could be set, I blew out my left knee. Not sure if I’d ever hunt the mountains, and because of that, I dumped them.
Then, the knee got better. Got me thinking, I can’t do what I once could, but I can get there!
Deals fell in my lap. I picked up a Tikka T3 Roughtech 7mmRm, a Tikka T3 Hunter in .30–06, as well as an Axis in .06 with a 110 stock on it. My brother-in-law wanted the Tikka .06, so I made a few bucks and kept the other two. Now, being with him for sight in, the Savage is a better grouper and recoil is nothing with that pad. Not afraid to take that dumb thing anywhere. Finally shot the 7mm a week or so back and it’s way lighter than the 270wsm was. Feels only slightly higher than the .06. Added a Limbsaver Air Tech anyway and recoil is no longer on the radar. At all. It’s a breeze.
So, looking things over, I thought I’d just take the .06, but as typical, I never stop looking, and I’ve been stumbling into some very useful, helpful information. Some are going to say, take the 7mm and .06 if you’re taking two guns. They’re still too close to really be that different with proper round selection and zero. But if I get into some thick stuff one day, and open air the next, why take the two closest ballistic pairings? Right now, I’m thinking my #1 and 2 are the Tikka 7mm, and my Weatherby .308.
I know some are shaking their heads, and that’s fine; I expect it. But here’s the truth. My grandpappy used to fly to Canada every year for Moose, and he NEVER owned anything larger than his 740 Woodsmaster .308. That man never came home empty. Not once. Today’s powders and bullet designs are significantly better than what he last used in the late ’70s. I can pack 180gr ammo and be plenty good to 250yds on the .308, and substantially better with the 7mm when hunting the open country, where shots to 400yds are far more likely.
At least, that’s what I’m telling myself today. 7mm with a 308 alternative in tow.
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