State Hockey Tournament Controversy

Like getting a Tournament Snowstorm, there has to be a controversy every year, doesn’t there?

The girl’s hockey final is set for tonight and it’s Andover HS versus Gentry Acadamy. I believe this is Gentry’s first trip to a final, but they certainly have been a feature in the state’s top teams and have made multiple tournament appearances in their short history.

Gentry is, for all practical purposes, a sports academy that offers high school classes. 100% of the enrolled kids play hockey. The school is essentially on the same property as the hockey arena and the players have access to school-arranged and sanctioned ice time and sports facilities and programs that the vast majority of schools cannot and do not provide.

Should these “All Sports All The Time” sports academies be allowed to compete in the Minnesota State High School League alongside schools that have a mixed student body of athletes and non-athletes?

Gentry is probably the most successful sports academy so far in Minnesota, and of course some would argue what’s the big deal, hockey is crazy anyway. There are already plans being explored for a basketball-focused prep school in the metro.

Let sports academies continue to play in the MSHSL alongside traditional high schools with balanced student bodies?

I have no problem with it but I think they should be playing the Hill Murray’s and Shattucks. All the charter schools that can pick and choose from outside the school district should be in their own class for the tournament.

1They were in the championship in single A in 2021.
2 Shattuck is much more successful than Gentry. A ton of NHL players have gone through Shattuck.

Mahto
Shattuck isn’t even in the MSHL.
Why Hill Murry they are a private school that happens to have a strong hockey program.
Not close to the same as a public charter school.

It doesn’t matter one little bit other than the increased practice time. IMO MSHSL should limit official AND unofficial practice time, especially during classroom hours. Lots of rumors going around that the kids at Gentry can skate whenever they want as opposed to public school kids that are in classrooms. I have zero proof of that being true, but that’s the rumor.

The reason I say it doesn’t matter is that everyone is doing it. I personally know of one kid that has moved around to three schools chasing a hockey title. The team they are on is made up of a number of kids that specifically moved for hockey. The rub is that at least three of them would be playing for a title tonight if they would have stayed at their original school. Basketball is even worse.

Correct. If you have access to star tribune look at the high school transfer article from a few weeks ago.

blackbay wrote:

It doesn’t matter one little bit other than the increased practice time. IMO MSHSL should limit official AND unofficial practice time, especially during classroom hours. Lots of rumors going around that the kids at Gentry can skate whenever they want as opposed to public school kids that are in classrooms. I have zero proof of that being true, but that’s the rumor.

The reason I say it doesn’t matter is that everyone is doing it. I personally know of one kid that has moved around to three schools chasing a hockey title. The team they are on is made up of a number of kids that specifically moved for hockey. The rub is that at least three of them would be playing for a title tonight if they would have stayed at their original school. Basketball is even worse.

Gentry allows one school class per day to be on the ice in addition to their after school sports activities. No other school does that. It’s a grey area as far as being allowed. They feel they are following the rules because their coaches aren’t allowed to participate in it. I imagine instead of coaches they have “instructors”.

Personally, I find it appalling they are substituting education with sports. Something needs to be done before we continue down this slippery slope. The MSHSL needs to get on this before it gets farther out of control.

So if that one class replaces gym what is the difference? Just a thought. Not saying if is right or wrong.
We did a lot of weight lifting in high school for gym and it was actually an elective class in high school to.

If you think Gentry is bad don’t look up the website for breakaway academy.

Ripjiggen wrote:

So if that one class replaces gym what is the difference? Just a thought. Not saying if is right or wrong.
We did a lot of weight lifting in high school for gym and it was actually an elective class in high school to.

If you think Gentry is bad don’t look up the website for breakaway academy.

Don’t know but even if it did focusing on one sport and only one sport isn’t education at all. Plus, one class for each semester/trimester adds up over 3-4 years. A lot of missed education. Not to mention that it is a charter school so you and I are paying for it whether you live anywhere near that school or not. A lot of people here are pretty resentful about paying for other’s education.

The only positive I see about gentry is that it is a charter school and not a private school giving those that can’t afford private school a chance to have their kids participate in a winning program without the cost.

biggill wrote:

Personally, I find it appalling they are substituting education with sports. Something needs to be done before we continue down this slippery slope. The MSHSL needs to get on this before it gets farther out of control.

I agree, in tech school/junior college it was always the same, the “athletes” could take a smaller amount of credits each semester just because they were in sports.

Look at the pro athletes, half of them can barely make a sentence in an interview then go broke when the money stops.

In Alexandria we have a little tension with one of these “hockey” schools. Maybe not even tension, but unhappiness? We have North Star Christian Academy. They do not participate in the MSHSL. They play in the NAPHL Tier 1. And they are very successful. The issue some have is a few of the top Alexandria boys players leaving Alexandria High School to play at North Star.
DT

there’s just something about playing high school hockey with the guys you have been playing with since mini mites… it’s a pretty special thing. Blows my mind that kids willingly jump ship so easily and so frequently these days. Turn your back on the program that made you the player you are.

Yes, in essence, some are questioning Gentry’s use of “free periods” and other time when ice time is being made available to athletes. This time and facility access is in addition to the official practices that must be conducted under MSHSL rules. IMO it’s only a gray area until you look at is anyone else doing it? No one has brought forth any examples of any other school that is providing time and facilities in the way Gentry is.

When 100% of your student body are attending a “school” to play one sport, I have to say I see all kinds of red flags here where regulating these sport academies to ensure league rule compliance is simply not possible.

I think the Minnesota State High School League (MSHS) needs to remember that the point of the organization and having a governing body is to provide a LEAGUE for HIGH SCHOOLS.

To me the test that needs to be in place is that all members of the MSHSL should be required to have an appropriate (by student population) percentage of the student body that is greater than the total of MSHSL participating athletes. This is an easy bar for any real high school to clear, but if 100% of your student body are athletes, then you are a sports academy, not a high school and should not be playing in the MSHSL.

MSHSL needs to get out in front of this because as I mentioned, it’s coming soon to basketball in Minnesota if this charter school gets launched and from there I’m sure the other sports will follow soon if they aren’t coming already.

We have the best high school hockey league in the nation in MN and I hate to see it get pulled in the wrong direction. As soon as you allow sport academies in, there will be more and more of them attempting to join and benefit from Minnesots’s great league and traditions for their own end.

Their facilities are not really different than most good hockey schools. Don’t disagree they are walking a fine line but if they are following MSHL can’t really do much about except beat them. Which on the boys side they have plenty of times.

TheFamousGrouse wrote:

Gentry is probably the most successful sports academy so far in Minnesota, and of course some would argue what’s the big deal, hockey is crazy anyway. There are already plans being explored for a basketball-focused prep school in the metro.

I would guess that guys like Sidney Crosby, Jonathon Toews and Zach Parise would disagree with that statement.

I always cheer against the private schools like Hill Murray, Benilde, and Holy Angels. You can add Gentry to that list now too. Hope the public schools whip the snot out of them.

Listening to Beyond the Pond on KFAN today, Pat Michaletti is not a fan of Gentry lol

When it comes to sports, kids and especially some parents will do whatever it takes to get them to the next level, playing for a weak community won’t help them getting more “looks”. Been this way for quite awhile.

Gentry is not private but ok.

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

there’s just something about playing high school hockey with the guys you have been playing with since mini mites… it’s a pretty special thing. Blows my mind that kids willingly jump ship so easily and so frequently these days. Turn your back on the program that made you the player you are.

Agreed 100%. I don’t really have a problem with a program with Gentry as long as they play AA. Same with all the other private schools.

So do you have a problem with the private schools in Rochester St. Cloud Duluth playing A or just the ones in the metro that are powerhouses? Just curious.

I don’t know much of the particulars of Gentry or MSHSL rules, but for those saying we’re ruining their education – you do know that a lot of Juniors and Seniors in any public school can easily be done with classes by 12:30 or 1:00 every day? I doubt it would be a rules violation to go to the rink at 1:00 for some extra work. That said, not a big of these academies and I do think they probably don’t belong in the MSHSL. Seems more like a junior hockey team or something like that.

Plenty of kids could go and do play junior hockey as well. Just sayin.

Ripjiggen wrote:

Gentry is not private but ok.

Yes they are. According to US Dept of Education, they are classified as a private school and tuition costs about $15k/year.

Gitchi Gummi wrote:

there’s just something about playing high school hockey with the guys you have been playing with since mini mites… it’s a pretty special thing. Blows my mind that kids willingly jump ship so easily and so frequently these days. Turn your back on the program that made you the player you are.

X2

gimruis wrote:

<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Ripjiggen wrote:</div>
Gentry is not private but ok.

Yes they are. According to US Dept of Education, they are classified as a private school and tuition costs about $15k/year.

They switched to a charter school in 2021.
Charter private doesn’t really matter.

Swimjiggin wrote:

playing for a weak community won’t help them getting more “looks”. Been this way for quite awhile.

I disagree. That may have been the case 20 years ago but scouting has come a long ways. If you’re good, they will find you. I think there’s something to be said for the kid who chooses to stay with his mediocre home town team, wear the C, represent his community and be the best player on the team versus leaving to go to a state bound big name private school and being a middle of the road 2nd or 3rd liner just in hopes that they will get more visibility.

If you are going to a private school and are middle of the road 3rd liner vs wearing a C at a week association you were not getting recruited hard either way.
Don’t disagree with more scouting however. Way more junior hockey D3 and D1 hockey than 20 years ago. Much more opportunity for kids to play beyond high school if they choose.
A lot more good players in the state as well.

Do not argue with rip, he does in fact know, every thing about every subject. I finally figured it out when he was tlking about a lake and the conditions with no actual experience

Ha pot and kettle meet Bearcat.

Who’s arguing?

Ripjiggen wrote:

Ha pot and kettle meet Bearcat.

Who’s arguing?

Never any arguing, that was phrased wrong. More so just ask rip he will know.

I think since this topic started as a girls hockey point, I’d like to talk about that since alt of this is going the direction of getting scouted. Obviously there aren’t a lot of options for girls once they’re done with high school. College, Olympics for the very best and maybe the whitecaps if they have the time. There isn’t big money in it so to reiterate my point, the loss of education worries me and MSHSL should do something.

My girl was lucky enough to be invited to the 8U AAA summer league where I live. She’ll be playing with the best of the best boys and girls in and around our organization. Sort of exciting but at the same time unfortunate because our organization is really underperforming in recruitment so we struggle big time in our winter leagues. Many of the best kids from our area have gone to play for Andover over the years. It’s frustrating as all hell for those of us still here.

I get the desire to move out but I just don’t see the massive benefit for girls sports whatsoever. She’d be devastated to lose her friends.

As always bearcat, thanks for the insightful input.