SAVE MILLE LACS SPORT FISHING

  • Profile photo of big_gbig_g
    Participant
    St. Cloud / Isle, MN
    Posts: 15,951
    #1154021

    Nice… posted to my FB page. Member donation on its way.

    Profile photo of suzukisuzuki
    Participant
    Woodbury, Mn
    Posts: 11,007
    #1154040

    I think I donated? That screen is confusing. There is no submit button after entering credit card info then when the screen did change there was no confirmation.

    Profile photo of big_gbig_g
    Participant
    St. Cloud / Isle, MN
    Posts: 15,951
    #1154050

    I noticed that too.. I just hit ENTER and it went. You should get an email confirming…. as a side note, below the donation part, there is another spot talking about the website and upkeep costs, I kicked into that too, but I think it was for the website that is collecting the funds, not for the Mille Lacs website Just a heads up for others

    Profile photo of big_gbig_g
    Participant
    St. Cloud / Isle, MN
    Posts: 15,951
    #1154103

    Bump for more nonsensical chatter…. this is our chance guys and gals. Let’s not give up or in….

    Profile photo of BuzzBuzz
    Participant
    Minneapolis MN
    Posts: 1,148
    #1154208

    Am I going to be only the third person to comment on this post?

    Steve, what do you think of the new Smallmouth reg? It doesn’t seem to be very popular with the Bass guys. I wonder how much pressure these new regs are really going to put pressure on Smallies? I wonder if they went with State regs would it actually increase harvest and more or less then the new regs?

    avatarsteve-fellegy
    Participant
    Resides on the North Shores of Mille Lacs--guiding on Leech Lake these days
    Posts: 810
    #1154287

    Quote:


    Am I going to be only the third person to comment on this post?

    Steve, what do you think of the new Smallmouth reg? It doesn’t seem to be very popular with the Bass guys. I wonder how much pressure these new regs are really going to put pressure on Smallies? I wonder if they went with State regs would it actually increase harvest and more or less then the new regs?


    Obviously, there will be more smallmouth harvest with the new regs in place. I would be surprised if it is significant enough to make a big enough dent into the huge numbers of smallies in the lake to have a positive effect per the plan and need. But maybe more will be kept and targeted than I think.

    I surely think the smallmouth can and should be a part of the sport fishery here, as it has been since records have been in place. But Lake Mille Lacs is a walleye lake first and foremost. It (Mille Lacs/and the walleyes) is part of Mn. sport fishing culture. THAT has to be protected and retained now and into the future. Allowing another species to bring that culture to a screaching halt is plain wrong. And that said, at the rate the smallmouth numbers have grown in the past ten years or more, the walleye fishery will not be able to come back as quickly, without bringing those smallmouth numbers down asap.

    Profile photo of kootykooty
    Keymaster
    1 hour 15 mins to the Pond
    Posts: 16,519
    #1154295

    I’m probably completely uneducated when it comes to smallies, but is there really that much harvest of smallmouths out of Mille Lacs annually?

    I feel like a shell game is being played here a bit. Quick blame the pike and smallies instead of tackling the real issue of targeting the same year class of fish year in and year out. Now I get all these species compete for the same forage base, so agressive predators such as these two species can have a direct impact on walleyes. My concern is will the new slot regs really increase the harvest enough for these two species to matter? Maybe there are more meat eaters out there for these two species than I think???

    Sorry, rambling a bit with some random thoughts.

    Profile photo of mplspugmplspug
    Participant
    Lake Mary, Florida Y'all
    Posts: 17,910
    #1154298

    Quote:


    I’m probably completely uneducated when it comes to smallies, but is there really that much harvest of smallmouths out of Mille Lacs annually?


    I wouldn’t think so, but I am uneducated too.

    I think the real culprit is global warming.

    Profile photo of Brian HoffiesBrian Hoffies
    Participant
    Land of 10,000 taxes, potholes & the politically correct.
    Posts: 5,663
    #1154306

    I don’t think there is that much harvest of Small-mouth no matter what the slot or limit they put on them. People just don’t harvest Bass, be it Small-mouth or Large-mouth.

    That said I don’t think there is a thing wrong with turning Mille Lacs into a destination for trophy Small-mouth fishing. I know all the Walleye guys think that’s like burning the flag or a bible but………..

    I have a seasonal way up on Kabetogama. You can’t believe how many people drive from Tennessee and other Southern states for the Small-mouth fishing. You can’t come close to comparing the size of fish up there to what they have on Mille Lacs. If the local resorts and the State tourism department spent as much on promoting Small-mouth fishing on Mille Lacs as they do Walleye then I don’t think the economic hit will be nearly what people think is going to happen.

    It has been said that the Walleye fishery needs time to heal. Why can’t it heal for a few years while promoting the Small-mouth? Do the resort owners really care who fills their cabins? Is a Bass fisherman’s dollar any different then a Walleye fisherman’s dollar?

    I know few people will agree with this but, it is worth thinking about I think.

    avatarsteve-fellegy
    Participant
    Resides on the North Shores of Mille Lacs--guiding on Leech Lake these days
    Posts: 810
    #1154309

    Quote:


    I’m probably completely uneducated when it comes to smallies, but is there really that much harvest of smallmouths out of Mille Lacs annually?

    I feel like a shell game is being played here a bit. Quick blame the pike and smallies instead of tackling the real issue of targeting the same year class of fish year in and year out. Now I get all these species compete for the same forage base, so agressive predators such as these two species can have a direct impact on walleyes. My concern is will the new slot regs really increase the harvest enough for these two species to matter? Maybe there are more meat eaters out there for these two species than I think???

    Sorry, rambling a bit with some random thoughts.


    The smallie numbers issue all connects back to the netting.

    Any lake can only support so many pounds of fish per acre–all species combined. One will always dominate. But if that dominant species numbers go down to a certain point, another species can grow in numbers much faster than they ever did in the lake’s history.

    The walleye slot limits/gill-nets, for the past 13 years, brought down the walleye numbers and allowed the smallmouth numbers to grow fast( with no harvest allowed)– not unlike the crappie scene at Red Lake. Experts predicted this ten plus years ago and preached for many decades to NOT allow the samllmouth numbers to grow but……

    So, one of several things that need to be done to bring the walleye numbers back up to historical levels,is to drop the smallie numbers. All of the issues in the lake come back to having to accomodate the added netting harvest to the annual sport angling harvest. Take that aspect (the gill-net harvest during the spawn) away and the DNR gets back to historical sound biology.

    There was never a noticable smallmouth harvest. Walleye numbers kept them in check. Obviously that has changed.

    It is a mess…. and if it can be fixed, will take years to fix and alot of money.

    avatarjon_jordan
    Participant
    St. Paul, Mn
    Posts: 10,928
    #1154317

    Agree with Steve here. One only needs to look at Upper Red. Net walleyes to the point of no return and the crappie population exploded. Keep Neting the Mille Lacs walleye and you could very well end up with a lake completely doninated by smallies.

    -J.

    Profile photo of mplspugmplspug
    Participant
    Lake Mary, Florida Y'all
    Posts: 17,910
    #1154320

    So what I am getting out of this is that if you net the walleye, trophy bass and pike take over.

    Hmmm………

    avatarjon_jordan
    Participant
    St. Paul, Mn
    Posts: 10,928
    #1154326

    Quote:


    So what I am getting out of this is that if you net the walleye, trophy bass and pike take over.

    Hmmm………


    What I get out of it is this. If you want a balanced, healthy, sustainable sport fishery, stop the netting.

    -J.

    Profile photo of crawdaddycrawdaddy
    Participant
    St. Paul MN
    Posts: 551
    #1154555

    Quote:


    Quote:

    So what I am getting out of this is that if you net the walleye, trophy bass and pike take over.

    Hmmm………


    What I get out of it is this. If you want a balanced, healthy, sustainable sport fishery, stop the netting.

    -J.


    And since more walleyes are harvested by hook and line anglers than by netting, maybe that should stop too. Don’t be mad at bass anglers just because we were the ones to invent catch and release. Walleye fishing in general emphasizes harvest, bass fishing in general emphasizes sport fishing. I like the part about resorts and MN tourism promoting smallmouth fishing. Bass fishing is far and away more popular than walleye fishing in America. If the walleye crowd really wanted to get rid of all the bass they’d just lobby the DNR to allow the Bassmaster Elite Series to hold a tourney on Mille Lacs.

    avatarsteve-fellegy
    Participant
    Resides on the North Shores of Mille Lacs--guiding on Leech Lake these days
    Posts: 810
    #1154556

    I will away from the computer all of today on the road….
    If need be, I will respond again later tonight. Thanks!

    Booth 651 at the NW show…

    Profile photo of mplspugmplspug
    Participant
    Lake Mary, Florida Y'all
    Posts: 17,910
    #1154561

    Actually walleye fishermen practice selective harvest. They keep mostly “eaters” and let bigger fish go. It’s a pretty sound practice.

    avatarAllenW
    Participant
    Mpls, MN
    Posts: 2,881
    #1154593

    “”
    That said I don’t think there is a thing wrong with turning Mille Lacs into a destination for trophy Small-mouth fishing. I know all the Walleye guys think that’s like burning the flag or a bible but………..
    “”

    Correct me if I’m wrong here, but isn’t ML’s considered one of the greater natural breeding lakes of walleyes in the state?

    That’s what would be wrong with turning ML’s into a bass lake.
    You sound just like the musky inc guys whould care less about what’s in a lake other than dumping musky’s into it, no matter what damage it does.

    Al

    Profile photo of Palerider77Palerider77
    Participant
    Posts: 600
    #1154695

    Donation site is working today, donation sent, bump ttt.

    avatarmanselmo07
    Participant
    Hudson WI
    Posts: 42
    #1154809

    “Actually walleye fishermen practice selective harvest. They keep mostly “eaters” and let bigger fish go. It’s a pretty sound practice.”

    Incorrect. Walleye fisherman are force fed selective harvest based on changing slot limits.

    avatarbilleno
    Participant
    Posts: 2
    #1154840

    Quote:


    Quote:

    Quote:

    So what I am getting out of this is that if you net the walleye, trophy bass and pike take over.

    Hmmm………


    What I get out of it is this. If you want a balanced, healthy, sustainable sport fishery, stop the netting.

    -J.


    And since more walleyes are harvested by hook and line anglers than by netting, maybe that should stop too. Don’t be mad at bass anglers just because we were the ones to invent catch and release. Walleye fishing in general emphasizes harvest, bass fishing in general emphasizes sport fishing. I like the part about resorts and MN tourism promoting smallmouth fishing. Bass fishing is far and away more popular than walleye fishing in America. If the walleye crowd really wanted to get rid of all the bass they’d just lobby the DNR to allow the Bassmaster Elite Series to hold a tourney on Mille Lacs.



    Bass may be the most popular fish in America, but we are in Minnesota and it is our state fish.

    avatarbilleno
    Participant
    Posts: 2
    #1154846

    Quote:


    I’m probably completely uneducated when it comes to smallies, but is there really that much harvest of smallmouths out of Mille Lacs annually?

    I feel like a shell game is being played here a bit. Quick blame the pike and smallies instead of tackling the real issue of targeting the same year class of fish year in and year out. Now I get all these species compete for the same forage base, so agressive predators such as these two species can have a direct impact on walleyes. My concern is will the new slot regs really increase the harvest enough for these two species to matter? Maybe there are more meat eaters out there for these two species than I think???

    Sorry, rambling a bit with some random thoughts.


    There is no harvest in Mille Lacs accept a few 21+ inchers. Most Bass guys go grafite and release. The DNR has finally figured out what we have known for over 5 years. Predation is 1 of the many factors that the DNR has ignored for years. This isn’t about a war on bass guys.

    avatarsteve-fellegy
    Participant
    Resides on the North Shores of Mille Lacs--guiding on Leech Lake these days
    Posts: 810
    #1156185

    TTT

    avatarPig-hunter
    Participant
    Southern Minnesota
    Posts: 484
    #1156353

    Quote:


    Quote:

    Quote:

    So what I am getting out of this is that if you net the walleye, trophy bass and pike take over.

    Hmmm………


    What I get out of it is this. If you want a balanced, healthy, sustainable sport fishery, stop the netting.

    -J.


    And since more walleyes are harvested by hook and line anglers than by netting, maybe that should stop too. Don’t be mad at bass anglers just because we were the ones to invent catch and release. Walleye fishing in general emphasizes harvest, bass fishing in general emphasizes sport fishing. I like the part about resorts and MN tourism promoting smallmouth fishing. Bass fishing is far and away more popular than walleye fishing in America. If the walleye crowd really wanted to get rid of all the bass they’d just lobby the DNR to allow the Bassmaster Elite Series to hold a tourney on Mille Lacs.


    It probably is more popular overall, but definitely not in the Midwest. Eyes are king round these parts. Hard to justify letting one of the best eye producing lakes in the nation be left to smallies or slimers.

    I like smallies, but if they need to be reduced to help save the eyes in the lake, well then I guess I have no problem watching guys knife em, or bang them off the sides of their boats.

    avatarCal
    Participant
    Savage, MN USA!!!
    Posts: 58
    #1156507

    Quote:


    I like smallies, but if they need to be reduced to help save the eyes in the lake, well then I guess I have no problem watching guys knife em, or bang them off the sides of their boats.


    Well now, isn’t that sporting!

    avatarPig-hunter
    Participant
    Southern Minnesota
    Posts: 484
    #1156518

    Quote:


    Quote:

    I like smallies, but if they need to be reduced to help save the eyes in the lake, well then I guess I have no problem watching guys knife em, or bang them off the sides of their boats.


    Well now, isn’t that sporting!


    Didn’t say I was gonna do it, but it will be happening. Now that the DNR comes out and says how the smallies and northern need to be reduced, guys will kill them.

    Profile photo of kootykooty
    Keymaster
    1 hour 15 mins to the Pond
    Posts: 16,519
    #1156527

    Well I hope they get turned in. A real sportsman won’t do something so stupid.

    I imagine a few will be fooled by this shell game the DNR is playing, but for those of us who have followed the Mille Lacs issue for years know what is going on. Do I believe the smallies and pike are in direct competition with the eyes when it comes to the forage base, sure I do. I don’t however believe there are enough smallies taken from Mille Lacs to have any impact at all.

    avatarsteve-fellegy
    Participant
    Resides on the North Shores of Mille Lacs--guiding on Leech Lake these days
    Posts: 810
    #1156534

    Here is what the DNR reps have not said to anyone…could their own info be wrong and not lead to an end?

    Based on DNR info supplied in recent weeks:

    –approx. 1 million pounds of adult walleyes in the lake now

    –average size about 3 lb.s

    –equates to around 350-400,000 adult walleyes in the lake now

    –no year classes left form ‘09, ‘10, ‘11 and ‘12. ( based on whatever—will the ‘13 hatch be around next year or 4-5 years from now to be at least 15-16” long?—no sound reason to believe that)

    –conservative estimates of harvest for 2013 and beyond for the next 5 years (unless regs change)

    1. Tribal harvest at 40K lbs. per at an average of 2lbs per fish = 20K walleyes

    2. total sport angler harvest at 150K at an average 3lbs. ( 20” long)+ 50K walleyes

    3. total fish killed per year—70K

    4. no year classes coming up?

    5. 5 years looking ahead? Walleye gone from Mille Lacs

    Based on actual info from the Mn. DNR in recent weeks, THAT is reality unless changes are put in place asap….and is NOT debatable based on present plans that are in place for 2013. That is using the “if’ the tribe and sport anglers don’t reach quota’s or beyond. If they/we do…the years you have fish left shrink.

    I hope the above equation is wrong……but it is VERY hard to dispute with hard info based with on what is on record with the DNR fishery experts.

    http://www.savemillelacssportfishing.org/

    Profile photo of Jack NaylorJack Naylor
    Participant
    Apple Valley, MN
    Posts: 5,553
    #1156637
    Quote:

    I like smallies, but if they need to be reduced to help save the eyes in the lake, well then I guess I have no problem watching guys knife em, or bang them off the sides of their boats.


    I’d HAVE TO side with Macsimus, anyone who would think of such a thing isn’t much of a fisherman, or anywhere near a sportsman. Fish within the legal regs and it is still very easy to be ethical too.
    I do not think the majority of the Walleyes compete with the majority of the Smallies for habitat or forage.

    I enjoy my time on the water and don’t ever kill a fish, unless my lovely wife asks me for a fish dinner every now and then,
    then I have to going fishing to obtain her a nice dinner.

    Thanks Steve for the added information; shocking.
    Jack

    avatarsteve-fellegy
    Participant
    Resides on the North Shores of Mille Lacs--guiding on Leech Lake these days
    Posts: 810
    #1156663

    Yes, that equation is meant to be “shocking”. If Mille Lacs fans and business owners don’t get shocked into fixing the mess now, the shock will be worse later–to say the least!

    How anybody thinks doing the same thing over and over again, with the results of the past few years in place, is not worth becoming proactive with SAVE MILLE LACS SPORT FISHING, is beyond me.

    This legal action is very winnable. Getting the nets out of the lake during the spawn is not a hard sell to the courts based on present day DNR facts and historical fishery management philosophy. ( we are not and do not have to argue treaty rights here) But the DNR won’t argue that on our/your behalf. We, if funded, can and will force the DNR to do their job. It is state law that they do so…

    Thus–we need to be able to fund this effort first…and get past the bitching phase that has been in place for 14 years.

    “you fail to score on 100 percent of the shots you don’t take”.

    “when something is important enough, you do it even if the odds are against you”.

    http://www.savemillelacssportfishing.org/

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